Estate Planning Sounds Boring... Until It’s Your Family - With Matt Eilers

We'll spend months researching strollers and preschool waitlist, but avoid having actual plans in place for our families.

This week I sat down with Matt Eilers from Medalist Wealth Management
and we talked about estate planning, saving for kids, life insurance, trusts, college funds, raising financially responsible kids, and all the stuff nobody really walks you through as a parent.

But this is NOT one of those intimidating finance conversations.

It’s practical. Real. Easy to understand. And somehow also made me immediately realize I need to update my own paperwork.

We also talked about:
 — why families fight after someone passes
 — what happens when there’s no plan
 — teaching kids about money
 — whether parents should buy their kids cars
 — one spender child vs one saver child
 — why starting early matters more than starting big
 — and why women NEED to understand family finances too

Every parent should tune into this one! Follow up questions @ NBTL

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Here we go. I feel like estate planning is one of those things we all know that matters, but it still somehow ends up in the category of we're gonna get to it eventually. Right next to organizing photos and cleaning out that one drawer. Like, yes, it is important, we know it is, but also not today. Until something happens or you start having real conversations and you realize this isn't just paperwork. This is a lot for the people that you love. And I also think for a long time it felt something that you do later or something that doesn't really apply to you yet. Hey guys, what's up? Welcome back to Navigating Between the Lines. I'm your host, Maggie File. I have had a lot of conversations lately about estate planning, or this is what's in the plan from a lot of avenues in my life. It's one of those things where we are like, yeah, we should probably do that. And then everyone just moves on. But I also keep thinking about this from a mom's perspective because when you have a baby, they send you home with a list, doctor's appointments, diapers, feeding schedules, apply for a social security card. Like you're handed a newborn manual, but no one says, Hey, do you have a plan in place if something happens to you? No one says, Do you have a will? Do you know where your accounts are? Would someone know what to do? We are fully trusted to keep a tiny human alive, but not prompted to have a plan for what happens if we're not here. And beyond that, how to set our families up for success for the long term, how things are handled, where things go, what life looks like beyond just the day-to-day. So today's guest is Matt Eilers from Medalist Wealth Management. I said that correctly, Matt.

SPEAKER_01 1:44

Yes, you got it. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:45

But also someone I know in real life, not just professionally. One of the things I like about Matt is we listen to the same 2000s music.

SPEAKER_02 1:55

That's right.

SPEAKER_00 1:56

And he's one of those people where you start talking casually and then suddenly you're like, wait, this is actually really important information. So, Matt, I'm super glad you're here today.

SPEAKER_01 2:05

I'm honored to be here. Thank you, man.

SPEAKER_00 2:07

Welcome to Navigating Between the Lines. Real quick, I know this answer, but for the listeners today, why are you the right person for this conversation today?

SPEAKER_01 2:17

Well, first and foremost, I'm a dad, um, parent just like you. Got three boys. Um, so I love the topic and I love that we're thinking about all this stuff through the lens of like, how do we take care of our kids? How do we make sure that they're squared away? So that's number one. But number two, um, you know, Metalist Wealth Management is my firm. I've been in financial planning in that arena uh for almost two decades now. And it spans a lot of different avenues, but uh a big part of it is advising people on different estate planning strategies, which here's the thing like for anyone that's listening in, that I just want to say, you know, I'm a small town kid from Whitehall, Michigan. When I heard the word estate as like an 18-year-old, I thought this is like, you know, lifestyles of the rich and famous, billionaires and stuff. But it's it's so much simpler than that. So I'm hoping we can simplify some of that today.

SPEAKER_00 3:11

No, I'm glad I said that because I said that too. You think it's like something, just like you said.

SPEAKER_01 3:16

Yeah, that doesn't apply to you. But in reality, like if you own anything or you have brought another life into this world, it really, really matters. And I think there's just some really important stuff to do. So my world is is inundated with helping people make sure that they've got all these different boxes checked off. And whether it's in like financial related terms or making sure what they've done with their wealth doesn't get messed up if something happens to them and they're gone and making sure that their kids get it the way that they want and and giving them help and and all that.

SPEAKER_00 3:50

So you do all avenues of the plan.

SPEAKER_01 3:52

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 3:53

Okay. I'm just gonna ask this the way people are actually thinking it. And you did kind of answer, but who really does need the estate planning? Like, you know, like we said, we for a long time you assume it's for something later or for for people at a different stage of life. But when should people start to think about that?

SPEAKER_01 4:14

I think um there's a couple things. When you turn 18, there's there's some certain things that you need to be thinking about. So take take yourself back to when you're an 18-year-old. I'm an 18-year-old. I I hear this and I'm like, what are you talking about? I'm trying to go to college and try and do all these things. If you're an 18-year-old with like a really good head on your shoulders and you're starting to own things, like maybe you own your first vehicle or um you you buy a house in your early 20s or something like that. You need to have a plan for what's gonna happen if something happens to you with that asset. So as soon as you have an asset, and that can be a car, a car, seriously.

SPEAKER_00 4:50

That's like what I'm thinking about. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:52

Yeah. Now, I mean, it a lot of 18-year-olds are gonna hear this be like, my parents are dealing with that. But but you know, there's some different individuals. I think the biggest turning point for somebody is when they become parents. That's a big deal. And like the concept or the term estate planning, honestly, it just means making sure you have the right legal documents in place. It's just paper, making sure you have the right paperwork that's notarized that tells somebody how your stuff needs to play out if you're gone. So, like hearing that term, I think can be overwhelming. Cause you're like, oh my God, I got a plan for it. It's not that bad because all we need to do is make sure that everything that you've built is protected if you're gone and that the right people get it the way that you want them to get it. And and things can be left behind the way you want it to play out, not how somebody else is interpreting it. So that's what estate planning does. And just using the right legal documents that are very, it's not that hard to take care of these, can just script that out so it can play out the way that you actually want it to.

SPEAKER_00 5:58

Well, thank you for simplifying it like that. Because I I it can be, it makes me like a little I get a little uncomfortable because you go. I mean, I've been in these meetings and you're saying, okay, who's gonna get my kids?

SPEAKER_02 6:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:13

What age would they get money? It's like things you don't really want to think about. But what happens? And I want to know, have you seen this play out when somebody doesn't have a plan? When and they maybe tragically or something happens unexpectedly and they pass away. Who what happens? Who's gonna make those decisions?

SPEAKER_01 6:34

That's that's where that that's like the worst case scenario. Okay. And I have seen some examples of that play out. What happens there is someone else is making the decisions. So if it's let's just think if we're talking about children, yeah. Um, and there wasn't guardians named in in some of these legal documents, people are gonna be stepping up and either saying, I'm gonna take the kids, or the kids are gonna say, I wanna, I wanna go to uh aunt and uncle or or whatever it may be. Um, it can get really messy, especially if people are now starting like a tug of war. Maybe there's the one aunt that felt like, oh, I should do this, but the kids don't want to go with the aunt. They want to go with grandma grandpa or like whatever it is. Um so without the parents just naming the guardian, which that's not an easy conversation. Like my wife Steph, and I, you know, Steph, we we really that it took us a long time to figure out who the heck we were gonna name. Um like years. Yeah. Because, you know, as life evolves, like the people that come in and out of your life, it can change, changes so much. Um, that's a that's a hard one. And and I just I encourage people like, look, have the conversation with your with your spouse or your partner about like what do you what do you want to do? Like who's who do we trust? And who actually would do this if they had to step up? So that that's just thinking about like who's gonna care for them. Right. What if we have like these financial assets that maybe are supposed to go to them and we haven't done the like estate plan, we haven't gone and created these legal documents. What happens is there's a a process called probate. And probate is it's not something that you want to go through, in my opinion. So what probate is is it's it's basically the process of the courts deciding on what to do. And if just if you just have a will, that doesn't keep your assets out of probate. Um, believe it or not. There's a lot of other things that can keep your assets out of probate, like naming beneficiaries on your accounts or having a trust, stuff like that. But a will just kind of gives direction to a judge to try and interpret what you want to have happen. So um it, but it doesn't necessarily mean it's gonna play out that way because family starts to come out of the woodwork during probate processes, whether it's to like care for kids, or maybe it's all right, some of these assets are getting distributed. And now all of a sudden you got cousin Johnny who's like, Well, I drug deer for Uncle Uncle Tom on this land for 25 years, and he said I get the hunting land. And no, totally. And there's the, you know, the black sheep sister who moved away that comes back and says, Well, mom's tennis bracelet was always gonna be mine, and like all of this crap that it happens because families are messy, right? Right. You can avoid it all by just literally writing out what you want to have happen. Who's gonna care for our kids? What's gonna happen with our stuff? What are they gonna get? When are they gonna get it? Not the easiest thing to decide on, but creating those documents, it's not difficult. It really isn't.

SPEAKER_00 9:39

Well, and it's just so important because I keep even thinking about situations where things are planned. I mean, our parents are getting older, grandparents. If you still have your grandparents, and when they pass away, how much there is that's still to handle is crazy. So I just I can't, it feels like a lot if it's not set up.

SPEAKER_01 10:00

So yeah. It it is. It it it's it's overwhelming for the family that's dealing with it all.

SPEAKER_00 10:08

And uh what I just said about the messy families too, because I mean, I feel like we hear this in our real life. You always hear something happening and there's like a story with it. And I I don't know why it makes me, I'm like, it should not be that way. Like I never want to get to be aged, right? Well, I want to be aged. I'm saying like I don't, I never want my kids fighting over anything that will make me feel like I did something wrong.

SPEAKER_01 10:36

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 10:37

You know?

SPEAKER_01 10:38

I'll share with you a story that I my mom would give me full permission to tell this story. Um so I don't have any grandparents left, but my my papa, we called him, my mom's dad. So my my my Nana passed in 1997, and Papa remarried uh years later. He ended up remarrying basically. So they had the they had a group that would play bridge every single week. And it was basically the other couple. Her husband had died, so they they kind of got married for like companionship. Her name was June. And so they got married, and it was wishy-washy in the family. It was kind of weird, whatever. And eventually my my papa passed away, and he just kind of trusted that she was gonna do the right thing. All of her kids got all of his inheritance, and my mom and her four siblings got nothing.

SPEAKER_00 11:31

Come on.

SPEAKER_01 11:32

Nothing. Nothing was in writing. There was no legal documents. It was one of those things that he just he thought it was gonna play out the way that it should. So it was that was a kind of a close-to-home example where I'm like, are you kidding me? Like, all it just needed to be spelled out.

SPEAKER_00 11:48

Totally.

SPEAKER_01 11:49

Or or assets held in trust with stipulations. It was, it was kind of worst-case scenario. Now, granted, they weren't like multi-millionaires to where people lost, but it was the principle. Yeah. Like my mom cared more about there was pieces of furniture that she wanted, family heirlooms that she didn't get, um, that were more important than any amount of money that that they would have ever received. That all could have just been solved by um just putting some things in writing and and making sure that it's legal and and it didn't happen. So it can be avoided if you're listening and like you've thought that this is overwhelming. It's really not. You just gotta talk to someone that can help you with it. Totally and talk and have a have some dialogue with your spouse if you have one.

SPEAKER_00 12:31

Well, I mean, I think what I'm hearing is it's really just even in my mind, I I probably make it more complicated than it needs to be. But if we can do anything, it's just because you're already gonna be in a hard situation. If we can make it even a little bit easier for the people we love, we gotta do it.

SPEAKER_01 12:50

We have to. And it's we're talking about something that's inevitable. We're all going to die.

SPEAKER_00 12:55

Yeah, it's a one-way path.

SPEAKER_01 12:56

Right. We just don't know when. And we don't know at what stage of life it's going to occur. And and but if we own stuff and we have kids, like this, it's just a no-brainer. Yeah. And you don't have to be like super savvy about all this to get it done. Yeah. You know, you find an estate planning attorney that can draft the documents, or there's there's like online stuff that you can do now to if it's a very simple thing where you're just like, all right, I want to name, you know, executor of the state, I want a financial power of attorney, I want a medical directive. Like, it's not that difficult or that expensive these days.

SPEAKER_00 13:27

Okay. That's good to know. I want to ask this too. Do you typically see one person handling all of this in the household? Like, is it, you know?

SPEAKER_01 13:38

Sometimes. Yeah. Actually, a lot of the times. And and I really try and help families push the reset button on that. Yeah. To try and get like a disengaged spouse engaged.

SPEAKER_03 13:51

Totally.

SPEAKER_01 13:51

And and I see in a lot of because I our firm, we we tend to deal with a lot of retirees as an example. They a lot of them come through our doors. And it's usually one or the other that manages the kind of the finances in the house. And I'm I'm never right at guessing which one it's going to be because um sometimes it's the breadwinner, sometimes it's not. Sometimes they're both breadwinners and one just likes it more. You never know. But it there's a lot of like blind trust out there, which is good in a relationship. You trust your partner. Sometimes you're just like, cool, I know they're taking care of it. But I think the alarming thing that sits with everybody is well, what if something happens to them? And now we're like, where's all this stuff?

SPEAKER_02 14:34

Totally.

SPEAKER_01 14:34

Like, what accounts do we have? I don't know how to log into this website. Who's our guy here? Like, yeah. That's where it's like, all right, that that's we can't let that happen.

SPEAKER_00 14:43

So that's gonna be my next question. Yeah. So should both people know maybe not everything, but at least something, or there should be like a document maybe somewhere where all this Yes. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 14:54

A hundred percent.

SPEAKER_00 14:55

So like we have for all the women listening that do not take control of your finances, you guys, you gotta know.

SPEAKER_01 15:02

Yes. So, like a couple things that we do to try and circumvent this is like through our planning process, we don't just let one spouse come in. We say both of you have to come in.

SPEAKER_02 15:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 15:14

Because I wanna, I wanna sit with someone and be like, look, this is what we're building. And if something anything happens, you call me. Yeah. And when we build their plan, like we give them a physical thing that they take. And the first page when you open it up is in the event of emergency, here's who you call. Cause I don't know who's gonna open that folder. It could be a spouse, it could be a child, it could be I've done it before.

SPEAKER_00 15:36

Gonna you've ever been on a plane and you're thinking, like, okay, worst case scenario, I've texted my neighbor before, just so you know, there's a little blue if something goes down. Yeah, because there's a fear base sometimes now. I mean, you know, I lost my mom, and then there's this fear like, oh gosh, what if something happens to me? Anyway, yeah, to derail, but yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:55

Yeah, no, I I just I I think there's gotta be engagement. And you know, make it make a thing out of it. Go on a date and just talk about this stuff. Say, hey, we're gonna go on a date and let's have an agenda. Like, let's solve this tonight. Let's just have dialogue about it and make it fun. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:11

And because otherwise situations.

SPEAKER_01 16:13

I mean, you know how it is. You, you, you're super busy, your husband's busy. We you know, we have families, we have activities, we have businesses, we have all this, all this stuff. It's hard to sneak in these these conversations to get alignment, but we have to have it.

SPEAKER_00 16:26

For sure. That's what I mean. You're always pushing it off.

SPEAKER_01 16:28

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 16:29

For the most part.

SPEAKER_01 16:30

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 16:30

Okay. I want to talk about families specifically. If you have young kids right now, what are the non-negotiables?

SPEAKER_01 16:40

Non-negotiables. Uh, I think you need to have life insurance.

SPEAKER_00 16:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 16:44

So, because if something happens to both of you or just the breadwinner, we need income replacement right away for these kids, you know, to cover their lifestyle and their everything that they need and to save for the kids. So I think that's a big one right there. So figuring out how much somebody needs, that's you know, talk to a financial professional about that. Um, but uh also naming a guardian in the event that something happens. We gotta figure out what that might look like. Um and talk to that person to make sure they know that they're on the list. No, I was gonna ask you that.

SPEAKER_00 17:19

Yeah, do you talk to the people? Do you tell the people you do? Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:22

Yeah. I think you kind of they need to be on board.

SPEAKER_00 17:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:25

Um, that would be a heck of a surprise. I think if they're if you name them, they they're probably the type of person that's gonna step up. But I think that they shouldn't be surprised by that. Yep. Um and so so naming a guardian, that's huge. Having life insurance, that's absolutely huge. But then also having a last will and testament in place that just kind of names some stuff. Okay. And so here here's the big one. Beyond the will is is forming a trust.

SPEAKER_00 17:52

So if you hear this thing and you and like when also when you tell me this, this makes me feel like you like a trust feels like for somebody who has a lot of stuff.

SPEAKER_01 18:01

I know. That's how what I always thought too. So, cause you hear the term like trust fund babies and everything, right?

SPEAKER_00 18:06

So I'm thinking like Camptons, like gossip girl. Like, yes.

SPEAKER_01 18:11

That's what I always thought it meant too. A trust is just a legal entity on paper that can own something. And when you put something in a trust, it avoids probate.

SPEAKER_02 18:22

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 18:22

So anything that's in there avoids going through the court process. You have an executor of your state, which is the person that's gonna make sure all this stuff gets done the way that you want it to get done, not somebody else. And the stuff that the trust owns, which typically when you pass away, the trust becomes the beneficiary instead of the kids. So let's just say you've got a big financial account. Instead of naming two children 50-50 on the account, and then it just goes to them, the asset flows into the trust now upon death. And now the trust says, here's how it's gonna be distributed to the kids. Because a lot of people don't, if their kids 18 years old, they don't want them getting a million bucks dropped in their lap. Right. Because they're gonna go buy a cyber truck and and shoes and yeah, blow it. They can now you can stipulate and you can say, all right, I want this much to be distributed every year, or I I I want uh lump sums for weddings and first houses and at milestone ages. You can do whatever you want. But if you don't have that document, you can it's up to the courts on what's gonna happen. And most of the time they're gonna drop it in their lap because there's nothing that says otherwise.

SPEAKER_00 19:34

I gotta tell you this story. When I was born, thinking about you know, kids and like longevity. So when I was born, August 9th is my birthday. We're also you're in August maybe too. August 12th, Leo's in the house. My grandpa went to the bank. So I think the date was like August 11th on it, and got a saving spot.

SPEAKER_02 19:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:58

So I was born and that's what he was thinking about, which is so cool. Those just became mature. Like I just cashed them in last year.

SPEAKER_02 20:09

That's cool.

SPEAKER_00 20:10

Which was really, really cool.

SPEAKER_02 20:11

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 20:12

Um, did I think about that? Like that's you know, that's awesome. It I'm saying the story because I have two kids. They have birthdays, Christmas, they get money for those things. Random Hall Easter, you know, 20 bucks, whatever. You know, little dollar amounts here and there. Is there something we can be doing like with this amount of money with these kids? Cause I mean, just throwing it in like a savings account or, you know, I mean, a c I got one spender, one saver, you know. But that money does add up every year. Let's say it's a few hundred bucks.

SPEAKER_02 20:50

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 20:52

Is there a better way to be doing something with that money?

SPEAKER_01 20:55

Oh, you just opened a can of worms. There's so I have so much to to like think out loud with you through this. It's yes, there's a better way. And it comes down to I think like we have an opportunity now to help these kids make money, but let's turn them into investors young.

SPEAKER_02 21:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:12

Not just savers. Okay. Let's teach them about money and teach them financial literacy through, like, I'll give you an example. Um, we opened a custodial account for Jack, my oldest, and uh at Charles Schwab. And he gets to go and pick the stocks that we that we put it in. He's got like 400 bucks in this thing.

SPEAKER_00 21:32

So cool.

SPEAKER_01 21:33

But what we did, we made a thing out of it. I'm like, all right, Jack, this is how we're gonna research these socks. I'm like, what are the things that you think are cool? And we went and looked them up. He's invested in Nike and Hershey's.

SPEAKER_02 21:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 21:43

Um I like it. And we like, but it's for him now, he's got this involvement. He's kind of um he's got some he's vested in it a little bit. He cares more versus like, I got 20 bucks from Aunt Rannon and it's over here now. And like now he He's he's thinking about it more. There's a little bit more gravity around it. So, but in regards to like how can we, how can we get more bang for our buck? It it all comes down to what do we want to save for in the future? Um, do we want to save for college or not? Some some people are, yeah, I want I want my kids to go to college. No, I don't want them to go to college. I wanted to be business owners. Cool. If you want to save for college, get 529s. Those are college savings accounts that, you know, parents get a tax deduction for what can go in there. It grows tax deferred. Kids could use it tax-free for college purposes. Um, if they're not on a path to go to college, maybe there's a family business or you're just like, screw college, I'm not paying tuition and all that. Um, you can look at custodial growth accounts like an Utma or an UGMA, which is it's just fancy lingo for an account that is the kid gets control of when they're legal adults, but a parent can kind of it's like what Jack has. So it's an account that you can say, all right, we can put it in here and and you can invest some of this if you want. We can buy mutual funds or we can whatever. Yeah. Whatever makes the most sense there. Um if they're babies, especially right now, I think anybody listening, if you've had a baby recently, you should get them a Trump account. Um, these are the new um accounts that are gonna be funded with with money from the government, first thousand bucks. Um and then parents can can add more into that. And then you don't have to be a newborn to get one, you just don't get the thousand bucks. I don't even know what that's about. So it's it's this new savings account that he created. Uh, it was announced in the the Big Beautiful Bill Act and it launches in July of this year. Okay. But the government is seeding a thousand dollars for for kids that were born during a certain time. Yeah. So if you've had a newborn within like the last year, they qualify. They're gonna get a thousand bucks in this account. Okay. And then parents can add up to a certain amount of year that they want. At age 18, it turns into an IRA, which is just a retirement account. So literally, like you could build a retirement account for them early that like think about all of a sudden now you got a kid. If at 18 there was let's say 10 grand put in this thing over 18 years and it was compounding, they have a lot of money by the time they can use that in retirement. Like a lot of money.

SPEAKER_00 24:19

So that's I was gonna ask you this. What matters more starting early or putting in more later?

SPEAKER_01 24:26

Early. Okay. Starting early.

SPEAKER_00 24:28

And say like say you think like we don't really have that that much extra money at the end of the month.

SPEAKER_01 24:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:36

I mean 25 bucks, like seriously, every little thing.

SPEAKER_01 24:41

It it's it's such a good question, Maggie, about like early versus putting it a bunch later. Yeah. Compound interest is the eighth wonder of the world. Okay. And starting early is such a big deal. And like I'll give you an example. Um, we go back to like when COVID times hit. Yeah. Financially, we all everyone went through a bunch of stuff. In our household, uh, my salary got cut 60%. It was gnarly. And we have auto contributions for the boys' 529s, and we were cutting things left and right to just to get through that that turmoil. But that was one of those things to where we weren't gonna eliminate it. We just lowered it.

SPEAKER_03 25:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 25:21

We we lowered it down. I think we were doing uh uh down to like literally 25 bucks a month per kid just to keep something going in. Yeah, but you can like you can have an account like this and you can fund it with whatever you can afford. And that just comes down to knowing your budget and knowing how much that that you want to save. It makes such a big difference. Like I look in these kids' 529s now, and I've we've only dumped in like a decent amount of money once for each kid, and there's a lot of money in these things.

SPEAKER_02 25:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:50

Just from these little monthly contributions that all adds up. It all adds up and it's invested and it's growing.

SPEAKER_00 25:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:56

Um, so that's really good to think about.

SPEAKER_00 25:59

Cause I do, I still think sometimes around this conversation, it can just feel overwhelming. But I love to hear that.

SPEAKER_01 26:05

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 26:06

That a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 26:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:09

Consistency.

SPEAKER_01 26:10

Yep. It's all about consistency. And I think all of this, if we're saving for our kids, whether we're saving for their first car or we're saving for college or um whatever it may be, it's an opportunity for us to teach them something because we know they're not learning this stuff in school. You know, these these seniors graduate, they don't know how to they don't know what a budget is, they don't know how to write a check, which we don't really write many checks anymore these days.

SPEAKER_00 26:35

I write checks all the time.

SPEAKER_01 26:37

Nice. I'm a I'm an old school. I love it. Do you balance your checkbook?

SPEAKER_00 26:41

I mean, I don't balance my checkbook, but I do. I mean, I know I look at our bank all the time. Yeah. It's like my thing.

SPEAKER_01 26:47

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 26:47

I think that's just probably because I owned a business. It was like one of those I have that that brain.

SPEAKER_01 26:53

Yep. You know? Yeah, that doesn't turn off when you sell a business. That's for sure. So funny. No, but I think like we can teach these kids something. I grew up, um, we had a a mason jar system for uh it was basically teaching us a budget. We would get our allowance and then we would have to divvy up our allowance into different mason jars and pay family bills.

SPEAKER_02 27:15

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 27:15

So they were teaching us about this at a very early age. The first jar that we had to pay was our our church tithe. So 10% of our allowance would go in there. And then it was all right, family vacation. Let's all kick in a little bit. We'd put 50 cents in there or something. There was, you know, movie night. There was uh saving for uh different things we were gonna do. We also had a swear jar, which basically my mom would go grab stuff from the other jars and start filling in there, and that would all go to the church. Somehow that was always the the jar with that was the heaviest.

SPEAKER_00 27:45

But that's hilarious. No, I think that's a really good point too. Um I didn't have that question, so thanks for bringing that up. But it is something to really consider that a lot of these kids I'm saying kids, quote, you know, just like uh that are in college right now, don't understand how how it works.

SPEAKER_01 28:11

No, they don't have a clue. They don't understand how credit cards work, they don't know what it means to go get a mortgage, they don't know how to do taxes, like their tax return, or what that even means, or how to withhold from their paycheck. Like this is all stuff that can be taught.

SPEAKER_00 28:25

And I think it's really important because I said I keep going back to the car because this was a like when our kids turn 16 coming, they're probably gonna want a car. And I was gifted a car when I graduated, um, a Ford Focused station wagon. Yeah, I took it to college and I drove that thing for like eight years. But my dad bought that for me. And when I sold it, I don't know, I think I sold it for like 1200 bucks, which is insane.

SPEAKER_02 28:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:58

And I kept that money, right? So it was like a gifted.

SPEAKER_02 29:03

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 29:04

I know like everybody has a different family dynamic, but I've been thinking about this car situation a lot more than I need to. I think because I'm gonna have a driver in like four years. That's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 29:13

Which is by the way, that's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 29:15

But I'm like, as a parent trying to teach my kid financial responsibility, yeah. Am I giving him a car? Is he is he helping to buy the car with maybe some of this money that he's been saving? Like, it do you have a is this a weird question?

SPEAKER_01 29:32

No, I think it's a really good question. It's so ironic because I'm not kidding you. On the way to school this morning, yeah, my oldest Jack is talking about dad, what's my first car gonna be that you're gonna buy me? And I'm like, I don't really like that question. Yeah. Because like, I think you and I grew up with similar backgrounds. Uh small town. I grew up small town, like pretty poor for the most part, I would consider. I wasn't given a lot. I had to kind of hustle and and grind for anything and save for stuff. My parents helped me with the first car, but I had to kick in some money for that Plymouth caravan, the blue van that I which I was the instantly the coolest kid in my grade because all my buddies could fit in the van.

SPEAKER_00 30:14

Okay, well, hang on, I gotta go. When I was 16, I did have a red minivan too. Yeah, it was my mom's. And I every football game, it was like amazing. So I am with you on that. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 30:26

We, I swear we had like 19 kids in this van at one point. It was like the best. It was so good.

SPEAKER_00 30:31

I'm pro minivan for a 16-year-old. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:34

My here's my my opinion is I don't want to raise brats.

SPEAKER_02 30:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:40

You know, like my kids are growing up not the way that I grew up.

SPEAKER_02 30:43

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 30:44

And Steph and I talk about this all the time. We're like, we need to make sure that they're not entitled little brats. And they're not, but like I need them to have some skin in the game on some different things, which is why, like we, we, we've done some budgeting stuff. We do chores for allowance, like Jack learning about stocks. And um, I I show him his college account. We talk about it.

SPEAKER_02 31:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 31:05

And and I actually talk to him about taxes uh and and to help him understand what that means. Jack started a business. He's got a eBay business selling sports cards now. Yeah. So he's learning about maybe I can give him some.

SPEAKER_00 31:17

Yeah, yes. We'll take him.

SPEAKER_01 31:18

We'll we'll take him and sell and and we can work on a commission there. Um no, but like I think that there needs to be some skin in the game. I just don't want brats that like feel like everything's just given to them and they don't understand what it means to work for something. Um, so like Jack is gonna save for his first car. He's gonna, I don't know what it's gonna be, but we're gonna make him kick in something.

SPEAKER_00 31:38

Which because you know, when I I was a kid, I don't know if you've had this, but it was like you don't talk about politics. Yeah, you don't talk about religion, yeah. And you don't talk about money.

SPEAKER_02 31:48

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 31:49

And so I'm kind of always stuck with this thing, like, I don't want my kids to know how much things cost or, you know, that, but they're old enough now that the like Chloe says all the time, well, that's a lot of money, mom. You know, and I'm like, oh good, she does have some, you know, reference of it. But this is really good, you know, advice just to be able to speak that like taxes is a big one.

SPEAKER_01 32:14

I know. The Jack asked me the question a few weeks ago. He's like, Dad, why do we have to pay so much in taxes when the government just prints money all the time? I'm like, dude, like that's a really good question. There's a question. I know there's a lot going on there, buddy.

SPEAKER_00 32:27

Not gonna get to that answer today.

SPEAKER_01 32:29

You're figuring it out. You've started to understand what the heck is going on. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:33

Oh, that's funny.

SPEAKER_01 32:34

I know. I I just think like we it's on us. No one else is gonna teach them this stuff. Yeah. Um, and if we don't teach them, someone else is gonna try and give them their version of it. Yeah. And it might not be the version that that we want. So let's show them like this is how it actually works and happens. And I think they can be more successful. I want my kids to be, I want them to understand investing and saving and all that before they leave our house. Yeah. So they're going out and I don't want to bail them out. You know, I can't stand it when I have family members or friends where I see them make stupid decisions and they just get the bailout from the parents. I'm like, come on.

SPEAKER_02 33:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:13

Like this isn't that hard.

SPEAKER_02 33:14

Right.

SPEAKER_01 33:15

Figure it out, do some research or or talk to someone and just ask them for advice so you don't make mistakes. And I just don't want my kids to be in that situation ever.

SPEAKER_00 33:23

Yeah. No, that's really good. Um kind of random. But what's something, if anything, that parents overcomplicate?

SPEAKER_01 33:36

Probably college savings. Um I don't think it's that difficult. Figure out how much money you can set aside and figure out the best tool for that, for that account and and save it. Or it let's just say savings in general. It doesn't have to be necessarily for college. It could be for I'm saving to help my kid with his first home or his first car or whatever. Don't overthink like, oh my gosh, how you know, what do we do with it? Just figure out how much money we can set aside. Start setting it aside somewhere when there's a little bit of something there. Now figure out what the best tool to grow it.

SPEAKER_02 34:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 34:07

Um, and and just talk to a talk to somebody that you trust. Um, a financial advisor is a good example of someone that can be like, hey, this is good to go like create a brokerage account or create a 529 or like all this stuff. If you're listening and you and you hear these and you're like, oh my God, I don't know what these are, it's not a big deal. They're just different types of accounts with fancy names. Don't over don't let that stop you from starting to save for your kids. It's all like goes back to your question. It's about starting early, not later.

SPEAKER_00 34:40

Yeah. Well, that's what I was gonna say. I feel like all of this is parents in general, in every category. It's am I doing enough? Am I behind? Did I miss something? Obviously, every family looks different and it all has to feel doable. So you say start early, but let's say you haven't, and now your kids are getting into high school, you know, they get their first job. What's your advice for that?

SPEAKER_01 35:10

It's not too early to start, like start now, or it's not too late, excuse me. Yeah, like just get going. It'll say a kid gets a first job. This is an awesome opportunity to sit down and be like, all right, let's look at this pay stub.

SPEAKER_02 35:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:23

And let's talk about what all this stuff on here means. Because they're gonna look at it the first time. That first check and they'll be like, Where'd all my money go?

SPEAKER_02 35:31

Where'd my money go? Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:32

Well, this is a learning opportunity to understand taxes and understand, all right, now with this money, what are you gonna do with it?

SPEAKER_02 35:39

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 35:40

Um, because you don't want to just go blow it because then it's gone, and you realize how hard you had to work to get that check. So I just think it's a it we have so many teachable opportunities around us. No matter the age. Right. And then if it like, if we do this the right way and just put a little bit of effort into it, you know, all this estate planning stuff that we talk about, it's less of this huge, overwhelming concern because it you know that your kids are gonna be good stewards of your money. That's what it's all about. We we want them to be good stewards of what we've worked so hard for.

SPEAKER_02 36:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:14

I think that we can start that early and not let legal documents be the things that are gonna try and teach them how to be those stewards. Like we should do it, and they should see those legal documents someday and be like, oh yeah, that makes total sense. I understand why it's laid out that way. And I just think we're surrounded with all these different opportunities to just help them see, like you mentioned, Chloe, you know, recognizing like the value of a dollar. I think that's a big deal.

SPEAKER_02 36:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:43

And I think that's like that's a moment to be like, yeah, what do you think about that? And like you realize how hard it is to make that kind of money and and and how big of a deal does when we get to enjoy spending that money on you guys, you kids, or on each other, or this family thing that we get to do. I think that they appreciate things a little bit different when they realize the value of the dollar. I've only got one kid that's figured that out so far because the other are are six and four. They're not quite there.

SPEAKER_00 37:09

They're not thinking about that.

SPEAKER_01 37:10

But I can see Jack's wheels turning. And we're also we've kind of got to this phase with him where he's asking for stuff all the time, for us to buy him stuff all the time. Like, everyone, like, dude, what do you think that is going on here? Like, we print money.

SPEAKER_00 37:25

Yeah, money tree in the back.

SPEAKER_01 37:26

No, like what is going on? So if he like we start saying, like, we'll co-op this with you, but buddy, I know you got like cash up in your room that you've been hoarding from aunts and uncles and grandma and grandpa and all this stuff. Like, you're kicking in some of this. And I just think they appreciate things more if they've got a little bit of skin in the game, even if it's 10 bucks.

SPEAKER_00 37:47

No, I love it.

SPEAKER_01 37:48

Versus, I just bought you this. And yeah.

SPEAKER_00 37:50

No, I think that's a really, really good.

SPEAKER_01 37:52

And it sometimes it feels like I'm being hard on them.

SPEAKER_00 37:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:56

But I know I'm teaching them something and I think that's our job. I don't like doing it all the time, but sometimes I just want to spoil the kids because it's fun. Right. It's fun to do that, but I don't want spoiled brats. I don't want to raise a spoiled brat, you know.

SPEAKER_00 38:10

I love that. Okay, so I love this conversation. If someone's listening though, and they're like, maybe like we lost them, you know, along the way. It's a very overwhelming yeah. They're like, I don't even think I can do this, or you know, my husband takes care of all of that. If you're a mom and she's listening, what's one little thing you would say to do?

SPEAKER_01 38:35

I would I would today, right now. Okay. So if you're a mom and you're you're married. Yeah. Is that okay? So that's it. Okay, or you don't have to be married. Okay. Yeah. So if if you're a mom, if you're a mom, you don't have a partner, talk to somebody today.

SPEAKER_02 38:46

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 38:47

Like talk to talk to a professional and just say, hey, I I just need a little bit of advice on what's best for us. Cause like all the stuff I've thrown out here could be the right thing for one person. It could be completely different for somebody else. But talk to somebody about like what are the like mission critical things that I just need to get done and and help me do it. Like you're not in this alone. If you hear all this terminology, like there are people like me that can help you. So you don't have to figure this out on your own. Okay. You just come, you just go talk to somebody and you come in and you say, Here's my situation. And they're gonna say, Okay, I think that you should do this, this, and this, and we will help you do it.

SPEAKER_02 39:21

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 39:22

Find that person in your life. If you have a spouse, I would say schedule an appointment with them. Yeah. You know, schedule a date to to be like, I want to get on the same page as you. And we should be able to write out on a napkin what's going on with our what what happens if we pass or what's going on with our money. And I would just ask some questions, like, hey, I want to be involved if you're not involved. But if you're the person that is hogging all the all the planning and everything, like say, hey, I want to show you what we're doing. Totally. And I I want I want your buy-in and I want I want your blessing on this, and and I want to uh, this is a team.

SPEAKER_00 39:58

Good.

SPEAKER_01 39:59

Right. At the end of the day. So I just say like make it simple. Make it simple. Have the conversation. If you're if you're in this alone, find somebody so you don't have to be.

SPEAKER_00 40:09

Okay. I like that. I've got a listener question. Let's go for you. Okay. Um and this is it. So$35,000 roll into a Roth from a$529 an investment tool, or only to guard against overfunding.

SPEAKER_01 40:28

So what the listener is referencing is how 529s have the ability. So the 529, which is a college savings account.

SPEAKER_02 40:37

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 40:37

So let's just say the kid doesn't go to college.

SPEAKER_02 40:39

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 40:40

Up to 35,000, which is current IRS rule, you can roll into a Roth IRA. So you may be thinking, what the hell is this guy talking about? He said roll, he said Roth. He said, okay, let's just talk about it. Yeah. Rolling is just transferring from one account to another, turning it into a different account. Yep. Okay. So what a Roth IRA is, it's a retirement account, but it's literally the best one that you could have because everything that comes out of it is tax-free.

SPEAKER_00 41:08

Tax-free.

SPEAKER_01 41:08

Tax-free. 100% tax-free. So, like in a normal retirement account, so maybe you have a 401k or an IRA, you got a silent partner in that thing. And that's Uncle Sam. Yep. You may think, oh, I got$100,000 in there. And he goes, uh-uh, you got about$75,000 because the rest is mine. Okay. When you have money in a Roth, it's all yours. So with this whole$529 to Roth thing, it's just a, I think it's a good reason to put the money into$529. And then if the kid doesn't go to college, know that you've got this out where okay, we can roll it into a Roth. And now they have a tax-free retirement account that they can use down the road. So that maybe they're going to retire when they're 60 years old and they have a boatload of money that they don't have to pay the piper on. It's already done. And that's a big deal because taxes suck. I hate them. And they're only going to go up.

SPEAKER_02 42:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:02

You know, for the next 30 years. It's I can't even imagine. We're right now, we're currently sitting in the third lowest tax bracket in American history. And we hate taxes where they are now. Third, exactly. So where are we headed? Right? Not good. No.

SPEAKER_00 42:16

So So what so to go back to the question, would you take that$35,000 then and move it into the Roth?

SPEAKER_01 42:23

Well, you can't move it into the Roth yet.

SPEAKER_00 42:26

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 42:26

Um, it's gotta be later on, once they're I believe once they're over 18, uh, that that can happen.

SPEAKER_00 42:32

From a 529.

SPEAKER_01 42:34

I believe so. Yeah. I'd have to I need to actually that's I mean I need to fact fact check that.

SPEAKER_00 42:38

Well I know who this person is who asked this. So we'll follow we'll follow up with that.

SPEAKER_01 42:43

Good. That's perfect. That's perfect. No, but there's I think that there's a there's something to be said about thinking about rolling into the Roth or setting up a Roth for your kids if you have a business and putting money into that, putting them on payroll. So I'll give you an example. My company, um, my 10-year-old son is on payroll this year.

SPEAKER_02 43:08

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:09

And he comes into the office and breaks down boxes and wipes some stuff down and runs a vacuum every now and again, helps us stuff folders, and I pay him a fair wage for that time, and that money then can go and he can contribute into a Roth IRA.

SPEAKER_02 43:23

Love it.

SPEAKER_01 43:24

So as a as a business owner, I hope the IRS isn't listening, but screw them because they wrote these rules and we're following it. Yeah. Like we get the deduction, payroll deduction as a business owner, which you're familiar with. He gets a a retirement account that he can we can pump money into that is tax free and and growing tax free.

SPEAKER_00 43:44

So what if you don't own a business?

SPEAKER_01 43:46

If you don't own a business, you need to you need to, I would go do the five twenty nine thing, knowing that you can turn that into Roth.

SPEAKER_00 43:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 43:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:52

Yeah.

unknown 43:53

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 43:54

I have a little rapid fire. Let's go for you. Um, and this is about you. Were you a spell? Bender or a saver while growing up. First big thing you bought with your own money.

unknown 44:05

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 44:07

Um, it was a boombox.

SPEAKER_00 44:10

With CDs or cassettes.

SPEAKER_01 44:11

CDs. No, it was both. It was the one that it was, you know, the things you get in your room and it would have it was like this big and there'd be two speakers on either side. You could put a tape in it and a CD player. I had to buy that. Um actually, no, no, I'm gonna retract. I'm I'm remembering something before that. It was Nintendo.

SPEAKER_00 44:30

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:31

I had to buy my first Nintendo.

SPEAKER_00 44:33

Do you remember how much it was?

SPEAKER_01 44:34

Like a hundred bucks.

SPEAKER_00 44:35

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 44:36

I feel like it was a hundred bucks.

SPEAKER_00 44:37

Which is like crazy.

SPEAKER_01 44:38

And I don't think I had to buy the whole thing, but my parents made me pay some. But I did I that boom box, I paid for that thing. And the first CD I ever bought was Green Day. I love that. Green Day Dookie. And I put it in. I was so proud to have that in my room and listen to my music. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:52

That's good. One money habit you wish you learned earlier.

SPEAKER_01 44:58

Oh boy. I I would I learned a lot of money habits. I wish I would have learned a little bit more about credit card debt. Um, because my parents didn't really use credit cards. And when I got to college, we were all preyed on by these credit card companies, like, hey, open an account and here's a free shirt. Totally. Or whatever. And I I did that and I I learned the hard way on some of those. So I wish my parents maybe would have used those tools so that I could understand it. We were just always never they didn't use them. So I think that was probably I wish I would have learned about that. Maybe the negative side of it. We didn't really talk about that.

SPEAKER_00 45:36

Yeah. College fun, necessary or depends.

SPEAKER_01 45:40

Depends.

SPEAKER_00 45:41

Um we answered this. More important, starting early or contributing more later.

SPEAKER_01 45:46

Early all day. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 45:49

Well, I love this. Um This was a really fun conversation.

SPEAKER_02 45:55

Agreed.

SPEAKER_00 45:55

Well, one thing I do, I don't know if it like fits in this conversation, but with all of my guests I've had prior, I've asked them, like, do you have anything you want to ask me?

SPEAKER_01 46:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 46:06

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 46:07

Um what is what was was there a light bulb moment in this conversation that you're like, okay, that made sense and I need to have a conversation about it or it sparked some sort of action.

SPEAKER_00 46:25

I think, and again, probably because I d did own a business, I feel like a lot of this stuff felt like a refresher for me in a really good way. But I think the b biggest takeaway, like I'm gonna go home and I'm gonna like make sure that we have everything in place.

SPEAKER_02 46:49

Sweet.

SPEAKER_00 46:50

Because I'm like my mom was like my kid's guardian. I mean, we set that up forever ago. And so we have not changed that.

SPEAKER_02 47:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:03

Legally. Like, hello, yeah. I gotta do that immediately. Um so I think just how you said, don't overcomplicate it. I'm gonna go home. I'm gonna look at stuff that we have, and I'm gonna write it down. I'm actually probably gonna follow up with you later and go, And then what do I could you help me put this together? So that for me is really, is really good. And for anybody listening, you guys should do that too.

SPEAKER_01 47:31

I love that.

SPEAKER_00 47:32

I love it. Okay, so two sides to all of this, right? One is protecting your family if something unexpected happens. And the other is just slowly, quietly building something for our kids over time. And neither of those has to be perfect, it just has to be started. So let me see here. What else do I got? I think that's all I got.

SPEAKER_01 47:55

I love it. This has been a fun conversation.

SPEAKER_00 47:57

This has been really fun.

SPEAKER_01 47:58

Usually when I have to talk about this kind of stuff, yeah, it's with somebody that has just questions from a completely different perspective or in a completely different stage of their life.

SPEAKER_00 48:10

Totally.

SPEAKER_01 48:11

And this is refreshing. So thank you.

SPEAKER_00 48:13

Well, good. And I hope for anybody listening, I hope that they got this out of this too. Because like I said at the very beginning, I have had these conversations a lot lately, like one with an aunt, right? She's retiring, calling you out, but she's retiring and she's like, What should I do? And she's asking me, and I'm like, I don't know. You know, but so this is good, I think, for anybody young family family, kids going to college. You're pre-retirement, you are retiring. I feel like every stage of listener is gonna get something out of this, and that's what I love. I love this, you know. So, and if you want to share this with somebody, do it as always. Matt, you have made this easier for everybody. I feel like one of the I told you we're gonna have fun. I know you did. And I'm like, where's our 2000s mech? I gotta go get that. But this is one of those conversations that's a lot easier to have when someone else starts it for you, you know? So thank you for that. You guys, any follow up questions, you know where to find me, navigating between the lines. This was a good one. Thank you, Matt.

SPEAKER_01 49:27

Thank you. Thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_00 49:28

We'll see you next week.